speaker 1:  this call may be recorded hello Mommy hello hi
speaker 2: hi I just
speaker 1: want you to know that I am sorry about this a match I don't know what that means I'm sorry that I bought a see how much that wasn't on my budget just I don't mind what you need to be sorry for is the psychological abuse what you need to be sorry for is lying David I'm lying that I'm not lying not trying to deceive you you can go back and listen to the recordings of our calls anytime you like I don't need to or do anything about it but I'm not going to pretend that I was upset with you about a sandwich when we both know better what I can't hear you do you have a different speaker or microphone I think that I was trying to deceive you about the sandwich what you think that I was trying to deceive you about the sandwich I'm not telling you what I think you were trying to do I'm telling you that you can listen to all of our phone recordings from the last 7 Days same time you want so you don't need me to explain to you true and not true and I don't have to pretend asking you to explain to me true or not true I'm asking you to tell me if that's what you think about me I I'm not trying to imagine what your motives are asking you to imagine my mother's and I needed to see if you were trying to deceive me that's your motive I don't know what you were trying to do I'm not going to guess what you were trying to do none of my business what motivates you to psychologically abused me and my business motivational I I'm just telling you I don't have to pretend I'm deceiving and I don't understand that that's what you're alleging I don't know what you were trying to do you can listen to the phone calls anytime you want I don't need to make any allegations none in fact I'm not I'm not making an allegation I'm telling you that I don't need you just have to have it line and let you know that I'm you can you know what I'm just here's what I'm allergic to other Legends should go back and listen to all the phone recordings wage that's what you should do well I will let you know that you haven't done that that's that's what Imma Legend from the last 7 days that's true and I will do that allegations are spot-on then okay do you want the school to pay them back I forgot to bring it to you sure and do you want the Easter clothes for my mother they're living in my truck I'm not going to get involved in that kind of decision decision about whether she gives them to us it's already been made I have them you can make any decision you want, it's your decision got nothing to do with you and me I am not going to weigh in on what you're asking you to weigh in on and it's not right for you to pressure me too I just sent one them to be a burden to you like we'll give them to you but I'm just trying to support you and you doing that because that's your choice your choice hey does your mom doesn't have emotional stuff going on of her own let's see most definitely does no she calls me all the time and cries Jesus got significant emotional problem was she crying about Dustin bring that I'm dead okay that's called emotional manipulation of you she doesn't have an emotional problem you do she's creating a problem for you do you understand that that what she's doing is she's trying to teach you that she's the only person in the world who really cares about you you don't get that she wants to have control over you and that's how she's exerting it I wouldn't even know anymore she doesn't she doesn't want to lose you back to me she thought that she finally like you it she was finally going to get your forgiveness for all of her sluttiness because you were going to have multiple romantic Partners as an adult to walk to see what's going to get you to file court documents saying that she got time alone with her grandkids and now she's worried that she's losing you again did you end up calling on yesterday did you call earlier today and she called me now I told her I can come up there cuz I need to spend time with the family and she leaves the prospect of maybe having us all come up let me have an answer for you then I pointed out that I probably don't have to work yeah I mean it's not that complicated we went and visited her in July right yeah you went and visited her at Thanksgiving right before after that they asked okay I'm just saying we're we're still above-average on our visits to her we don't know where anything she's just desperately power grabbing right now anyways obviously you don't have to hustle work so do you happen to remember when I finished the Jack beef project no you'd have to ask my dad I think I got it figured out by just just trying to well you remember you were supposed to have it done when we went to Thanksgiving at your mom's house in a 2018 but it actually wasn't done and you still went to Thanksgiving at your mom's house anyhow yeah does that give you a frame of reference were you be here today when I when Janie was asking to see if we got our garden all planted and he was like not much and I was like no not really she said that she said that's okay we have grocery stores is a good thing about it like I can't even tell you how often Jamie said something and I have to bite my tongue to not be like you run out of bread they'll just let them eat cake boss just always has these great Solutions that work if you have money hey I've looked it up online and Google and a lot of places and I just need you to know that I haven't been able to find this thing that you keep referencing about it being unprofessional to be a marital therapist to a couple where you've seen one of them individually first I think that you're taking something really really specific where like Nathan and Megan and Ted Like knew that you were literally going to shoot yourself because you have this idea that you can't trust the people who are like giving you counsel and I think that they were for you specifically trying to prevent you from killing yourself and for you specifically telling you how you could get yourself in a situation who you know the person that you're talking to is unbiased for your benefit because you have such a tendency I don't know how they are represented to me and in addition to that the people that didn't know me that in the honey lighting gave talks and stuff but off what very informally find out that I was you know was interested in marriage counseling would say that same thing so what that if you seek marriage counseling it should be who with somebody that's not your regular therapist and to see both together but that doesn't mean how long has not no prior knowledge like you you need you need an individual therapist in addition to a marriage therapist any of the the point was that it shouldn't be somebody that has more familiarity with one party over the other okay I haven't been able to find that okay I get back to doing taxes but I miss you have you been able to find it in writing anywhere in the world I haven't looked for it all right I mean it's pretty intuitive that that makes sense though no
speaker 2: yeah
speaker 1: no like I could go to Ted and I could probably get him to understand our situation in fewer hours then if I went to somebody who's never met either one of us like I would not you know what I mean like this is the truth is the truth though it's not this is not an opinion or a who's right or who's wrong or just you know what I mean black and white actual to actual words spoken actual just black and white like stuff that we absolutely agree on okay like just the facts the stipulated facts okay I love you and I want you to be happy yeah how are you hoping that happens okay I can make you happy yeah but I mean how do you see yourself doing that
speaker 2: I don't know I mean
speaker 1: things online all the time and no I'm not asking you what you think about me or what do accusations you want to make exactly the same against the you said that I think you're lying all the time trying to plant in my head so doubt about whether I'm correct about that or not this is not the time for psychological manipulation you don't need to do that right now I'm asking you what do you think that you could do to make me happy how do you envision that happening not by convincing your wife that she's wrong when she thinks you're lying but what you do on your end that's why I said that I don't know I'm going to keep going until I can figure it out so what are you going to do this week secret you want me to finish our taxes so it's only
speaker 2: listening to our phone
speaker 1: calls okay hey was it if you can't make it to my session with Matt for can you figure out a way to get your mom to pay for it anyway I will try scheduled and I don't have any money okay and work on that are you going to do the whole thing with your mom about in being completely unprofessional to be willing to see us everybody at Honey Lake recommending against it and have you already done that not that I remember that means nothing have you already talked to your mom. Remember cuz sometimes you say you don't remember just because you don't want to admit it off
speaker 2: yes it is I
speaker 1: don't remember Witnesses we have lots of witnesses many people who have seen you say I don't remember because you didn't want to admit something okay I don't know what to tell you except that I don't remember I don't remember saying that I don't know what else about you okay do you think maybe you told your mom that honey like tells you to make sure that you got an unbiased therapist I have no idea I remembered I would tell you I don't remember telling her that all right oh did you talk to see a last night y a lot of time I got back here it was it's not fitting emotionally and then let me see if I had before you talk to your mom bye well I just thought that what he was saying sounded really
speaker 2: mature and
speaker 1: I'm telling you he has really really been through this with his mother I really was shocked when I heard him saying things like you know appreciate you so much but during this season like we really need to focus on us and we just have very very little to give emotionally I'm afraid the most that we can talk on the phone is probably going to be once a month at the most we can visit it's going to be twice a year you know it doesn't mean that didn't want time with you it just means that we've gotta like you know what I mean like the way he was saying that like it sounds really radical but you stop and you look at his nuclear family like kids actual biological kids and what he's able to do with Katie and Laura and Joe and Jessie when they have just as much junk from their extended family you know that's what we have he did not they had a lot of junk dust I mean the two of them are you know a lot more stable than the two of us but I'm saying it's because of the decisions they made for their own household to not be affected by what was outside of their own household that the stuff from the parents and the brothers and sisters and all this didn't hurt their children okay I think it would be really wise to figure out how that's done
speaker 2: okay
speaker 1: what yeah I think you had to go ice fishing yesterday you know that
speaker 2: yeah
speaker 1: have you heard him say that's that's the only difference between Canadians and the Florida rednecks right his he was the I guess cuz they're out you know in the I don't know roll area yeah and he's like these peoples just a bunch of rednecks like us only difference may have to cut a hole in the ice where they can go fishing
speaker 2: and
speaker 1: it's cold what can't imagine him having to go back and forth from there to here yeah you know Antarctica record-high yep was it 65 degrees absolutely warm that thing you did when you came to me and was like I want to ask you about charges that you made for late fees that was bad mine because you came to me the same way that you did at church when you were you know stopping me from the nursery into the hallway I wasn't going to ask you about it asked me like there's a way to ask people questions like to be like well I was wondering
speaker 2: I
speaker 1: think when I was at Honey Lake what were the wives do you have fees for a new attorney were you getting a new attorney and are you still trying to pursue our legal case I mean I just want to know that your tone was really accusatory like
speaker 2: what
speaker 1: were the charges for a lawyer you're not going to tell me you're not going to tell me what it was for I tell you it's a consultation your so you were doing a new strategy like it was just very very uncalled for sorry and and really for you to have had in that space of thinking time out to get you is not not healthy for you you know it's kind of the point of a lawyer isn't it no I told you that over and over and over and over and over and over when I'm doing that two whole stupid you're forcing me to fight you and like you were saying that you could be we could am a couple and not have attorneys and it kept telling you having an attorney has nothing to do with whether you're going to collaborate or fight off or be amicable or hurt somebody like you could have a lawyer and you can go to that lawyer and you can say I'm hiring you because my number one priority is to make sure that my spouse is well taken care of when this is all set it done and you can find a lawyer who's willing and capable of doing that for you it's obviously not what you did when you went and hired an attorney which is really gut-wrenching an awful but that's not what having an attorney means like that's not that's not it your attorney can represent your interest and your interest should not be to hurt somebody that you love so did you hire any attorney it's just a consultation and I'm sure whatever I paid Mike for was probably from like early December you know okay it still makes me feel really nervous that basically halfway through many time attending like you were pursuing legal activities when was it stop the January in January 29th Maybe and what day did you second the 9th yes yeah that sounds right Thursday yeah I I think I have a schedule that I like two months in advance so you know what I'm saying would have been I think it would have been pretty stupid to cancel it based on the things that you were saying to me while we were on the sounds like you're happy like
speaker 2: what
speaker 1: I just I was thinking today that like you know about going to work as a teacher cuz you know when I worked as a teacher before like like like I didn't actually like you know purchase anything with any of the money like it was just like I was just enough to cover like our debt service you know so even if even if we got like def to pay off all of our credit card debt and we just started making our payments to him if I got a job as a teacher and I gave all of my money to Jeff like it would be for school years before I could pay him and that's what you know what I mean this would be none of that would be with none of my paychecks going towards doing fun things with the kids or buying groceries or paying bills or anything I just literally four full years of salary it's and that's that's not even paying like the like that's what zero interest that would be if I could if we could get it zero interest with interest it's yours more than that I don't like sure cuz the teacher know but I don't think that you've been doing these kind of calculations all the years that you've been abusing credit cards am I say calculations I mean a like the math calculations of how much does that $600 tool actually cost you when all is said and done but also the calculations of what kind of what kind of childhood are your kids having and what kind of Life are you going to look back and say that you know you lived fifty years from now a good questions what so those are good questions what's the question oh I see yeah I call them calculations so because like when I when I decide whether I want to buy something like I'm calibrating all of that like this ten dollars like how does how does spending this $10 impact my kids quality of life five years from now the net positive or negative for them pretty similar stuff but I haven't thought of it in that contract which is important so I mean the context yeah the context is is that I would have to go to work for four years like and then he's taking care of the kids yeah but I don't want to do that right but that's I'm saying that that that was the calculation that was happening with you were making purchases like that's the calculation when you go to Tasty's is your prostituting your wife out to the world can you prostituting your children to a public school system so that you can have a hamburger I'm saying we're not as far as I'm concerned we're not doing that you actually have a way to pay for it when you made the purchase you didn't have a plan of how you were going to pay for it you still don't have a way to pay for it you said I'm getting at like a magic fairy isn't going to come and give me four years worth of salary for staying home and again with interest really talking probably ten years I'm sorry what I'm sorry about our financial situation and I'm sorry that I can't be there for you Christine you should not be close to me right now as I said I'm sorry you shouldn't be sorry it should be like grateful like see thankful okay I'm grateful all right huh and you say you just say whatever you have to say what what did you say to me I said cuz you switched from being sorry that you weren't here with me to being grateful just because I told you you were supposed to be grateful which doesn't seem to want me to you I know but then you just switch to you know what I'm saying okay so if I don't want that then you're not sorry anymore let me get back to work okay bye I love you okay goodbye